the tale of two trees

The second tree, however, is able to experience the wind in a comforting and soothing way. It looks good but God said that will kill me. Share. I've never existed in a state of pure moral innocence except maybe in my infancy. A light breeze blew across the valley and over the hillside. Tim: It's an image of the human condition. Tim: If I was like Abraham in that one moment when he did nothing but looked up in the sky and just trusted God, that was when he passed the test. Maybe. “Look at all the people in the valley. But it's with all the trees and it's part of just nourishment. Tim: No. Yeah, totally. January 17th, 2020 . We'll start again.". And so a human meeting personally becoming one with the presence of God in the middle of the garden is depicted through this image of eating from the tree and it's as if the fruit conveys God's life to the human through that proximity and intimacy. The tree of the knowledge of good and bad illuminates the human experience and places a choice before each of us. That's the thing that will kill me and hurt myself and others. I think that will be a pretty, sweet smelling necklace.”. Sunday 10:00 AM. Watch and Explore over 150 BibleProject videos. To invite a response. But the point is that in this conversation between a woman and a snake says, "Oh, so God said you can't eat any of these trees?" The tree of life is already there. We're a crowdfunded project by people like me. The second tree thought, “Wow, I’ve never seen anything like this! You followed all the God's commands, now you get the reward. It's like, yeah, that kind of speaks to just the human condition. Speakers in the audio file: It's not like, "Oh, man, I would really want to eat of the tree of life, but I think I want to hate my friend. That's before us perpetually. He loved the feeling of the cool moist soil as he stretched down into the earth. It looks good but God said that will kill me. Eat of that tree and you'll die. And then all of a sudden, I'm eating from the wrong tree and it seems like the right thing to do. The first pillar, the art of living consciously, is manifest in the second tree’s ability to feel the cool moist sand his toes and his admiration for the beautiful hillside. “What an inspiring hillside! The Lord God commanded the man, saying, “From any tree of the garden you may surely eat; but from the tree of knowing good and bad you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die.”. They were destroyed by the evil beings Ungoliant and Melkor, but their last flower and fruit were made into the Moon and the Sun. The second tree saw peace and happiness in the Gardner’s eyes. I think the garden narrative is telling you what we need around here is a human who's one with the Creator who can truly become that partner. So Let's send them out so they don't take from the tree of life and eat and live forever.". So I kind of can understand that. Tim: It's very important for especially modern misunderstandings of this story. The second tree swayed his branches in the breeze. So this reframes what the command about the tree of knowing good and bad is then. 53m, –  And let's say that Adam and Eve responded correctly. Tim: Arum. So the first divine command is to enjoy the gift of eternal life. And they have a particular kind of symbolism and meaning in the biblical story. Genesis 2:15-17 • Read Books On Your Phone? Tim: Yeah, eat eat. Two trees search for happiness. There are times where it's really obvious that's the bad thing. Tim: It creates a what-if possibility. Which is every other time it appears in the Hebrew Bible it's a positive. But then the just like the hindsight of a year or two to realize like, "Oh, man, all these other motivations that work that I can see now, but I couldn't in the moment. It's attractive. Or human kings can be depicted as sacred trees. Jon: That what I experience. We've talked about this before. Because remember, when they're exiled in vs. 22, God says, "No, they become like us Elohim knowing good and bad. Jon: A different story being that God's kind of judgment against humans for disobeying was that He would kill them. That choice is done almost unconsciously. And so the question is, how are you going to get wisdom? Tim: That's right. Consider the Palm tree with its straightness, the grape tree or vine with its abundant and luscious harvest, or the olive tree, which is a tree of light and anointing. The tree of life and the tree of knowing good or bad, how you relate to one determines how you relate to the other. In part three (23:00-34:30), Tim and Jon look back over the first part of Genesis 3 and consider the choice and consequences presented by the tree of knowing good and bad. I'm from Valdivia, Chile. Now, the tree of life and the tree of knowing good and bad... Jon: They're both there. May 13, 2014. Jon: And when you frame it that way, my thought isn't "why did God do that?" As the morning light chased away the darkness, a young Gardner sat on a quiet hillside gazing down into a valley. It's another way they're similar. And it all hits the fan. According to “The Parent’s Handbook: Systematic Training for Effective Parenting” by Don Dinkmeyer, encouragement is the most effective tool to foster self-esteem in our children. Jon: And I think what's good about the way you talk about that is that it's not like, "Oh, man, am I going to eat of that tree or not?" So what's all the trees? Jon: We talked about this when we did our question response on the Satan. Actually, don't quote me on that. Two trees. So that's all the way back to one of our first videos. Because the first question Got ask is, "Where are you guys? Let me tell you what God knows because I've heard Him talk about it." That's the setup here. Tim: That's right. People are trees. I think there's an element of truth. They both knew that blossoms grow into apples! And that meaning is introduced in Genesis 1 and 2 where trees are a real focal point. Jon: God plants the garden. But then you also said, which is really interesting, we need some sort of new mode of being human. Genesis 3:22 The tree presents the opportunity for humanity to have proximity with God and receive life in his presence. Those two trees started growing next to each other, and at times it probably felt like they were fighting each other, competing for water or sun or space to spread their branches. Our story begins back in the garden, the garden of Eden, that is. Jon: People are trees - to be a metaphor? She made two shallow holes in the soil. I won’t have enough to make the Gardner proud,” he worried. The fourth pillar, the art of being self assertive, suggests that we must think and live life for ourselves. Tim: Why is God coming asking questions? You're born into a scene where you're already set up to fail. I think the reason why it's so ambiguous, this biblical narrative in general, these ambiguities are there to make you ponder and reread and then go read the rest of the Bible, and then bring what you learned back to bear on those ambiguities and so on. Seems like "I'm going to test you.". And I start to feel like I deserve some more time off. Thanks for joining us. Jon: I don't know. The tale of two trees tells us something profound about the human condition and the choice There are two trees in the garden, and humanity is presented with a choice: trust God and enjoy his good gifts or take the knowledge of good and bad for themselves. Although the two trees couldn’t talk to each other, a friendship developed between them as they stood day after day together on the peaceful hill. “Wow!” exclaimed the first little tree. A Tale of Two Trees Trees are marvelous things, and they also teach us a great deal. It looks beautiful. Another tree is found in the middle of the garden, the tree of knowing good and bad. They will admire my apples and the Gardner will be proud.”. And that's true in this narrative. And so it's about living in connection with God. The first tree is expecting the Gardner to come and take care of its needs, while the second tree takes personal responsibility to provide for himself. We need to have a souped-up upgraded version of humanity that can truly partner with God and bring about the new Eden. The first tree is not living with open senses to the world around, but instead is more concerned with his need to search for external acceptance. It feels not a test I would want give anyone. Why do you ask questions? So it's very important. I also like that by lumping it with all the other trees you can eat from, it kind of helps me think about it more as a daily thing. Saturday 6:00 PM, Sunday 9:00 AM, Sunday 10:45 AM. So when this hit me, and I realized I've been reading a different story into these words, and not letting the words say what they actually mean. So the first sentence of Genesis 3, "Now, the snake or the serpent was more arum than any beast of the field. Tim: We have in other videos and conversations talked about the scene. Let me tell you a tale of two trees. So the snake was telling the truth. Correct. The word "test" in Hebrew, it's verb nasah. Good job. ", Jon: The snake is like, "Wait, God said none of the trees?". That's a whole nother conversation. It's a step of going, "You know, as it pertains to my relationships with others. A Tale of Two Trees. And to rule, you need wisdom. They would talk about such trees. This is a perfect place for me!”. Expand. No, no, no. A Tale of Two Trees. There's something that critically broke in the human condition that can't be fixed. It does not say that. "That's weird that God would say don't eat from that because... Jon: Having the ability to no good from bad is an attractive proposition? Vs. 16, "Yahweh God commanded - first divine command - commanded the human saying, 'From all the trees of the garden you may eat eat (in Hebrew).'". Tim Mackie. Welcome to the story of Abraham. “That was on of the best days I ever had!” he said at sundown. That's the way these trees relate to each other. I don't want you to die die. We've talked about this many times. Additional Resources I don't know what age works. Tim: Exactly. Jon: But If we put that then construct onto this narrative of Genesis 2 and 3, I don't know, it feels strange to have a test. Jon: Another thing is there's something very corruptive about eating of this tree where it's not like God can say, "Hey guys, bad idea. The second tree continued to smile, laugh, and play with all the visitors to the beautiful hillside. Here we go. Jon: Oh, interesting. That's relevant to the last thing that she sees, which is she sees that it's desirable to make one wise. But then something beautiful happened: Their roots grew together and they became inseparable. I guess I've always pictured the tree of life as the prize at the end. A Tale of Two Trees. Facebook. “Wow” admired the second tree. Who told you naked? The Tree of Knowledge, on the other hand, drives you out from the eternal life with God. Okay, yeah, thank you. Jon: It's not a reward for doing good. It says, "it will lead to death." The second tree shook with excitement. That's the way these trees relate to each other. That's a good thing. After God in humans, they're the most talked about organic living thing. This passage introduces the snake as shrewd—one who is able to use their knowledge for good or terrible ends. Tim: I see. Now their otherness becomes a sense of alienation and division. Tree of Life Q+R #1. But this creature knows what's up. Tim shares that the two trees in the garden are pictured next to each other. Copy. Dad planted a tree in the front yard and I just knew that in no time it would grow tall and strong enough for my tree house. Because of the expectations he feels to bear fruit, the first tree is unable to enjoy the company of the children and world around him. Jon: Because you think about like if...let's take children who don't know good from bad. And then the serpent say, "You won't die die. Lots of life around trees. Jon: Game over. So God said, "Have you eaten from the tree?" YOU // What are you waiting for Waiting Here For You Series. So you're doing what you're supposed to do? Tim: Yeah. "I will now sail the roaring oceans," thought the second tree. Suddenly, a blinding bolt of lighting streaked across the sky. There's actually a long-standing conversation going back to second temple Jewish literature about if Adam and Eve blew a chance to repent. Tim: Ah, the meaning of trees in the Bible in general. The fire had taken all the leaves, apples, and small branches from the second tree. And then all sudden... Tim: Yeah, that's right. Gary Basheers [SP], one of my theological mentors, many years ago, he first pointed this out to me. Jon: Oh, yeah. Tim: Two trees. Two books about trees pretty much tell the story of why we’re in the mess we’re in. Trees are an image of perpetual life of continually bearing new life from within themselves. And he said to the woman, “Indeed, has God said, ‘You shall not eat from any tree of the garden’?” The woman said to the serpent, “From the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat; but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, ‘You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.’” The serpent said to the woman, “You surely will not die! The truth about you becomes known so that you can do something about it. Now in the next episode, we talked about there are two specific trees in the garden narrative in Genesis 2. Sometimes, little worker bees would come and visit the trees. You just repeat the verb twice. But usually, we just highlight the negative nature of the test. There's trees that are good to look at, there's trees for food, and then in the middle of the garden... Tim: ...with one river flowing out and then flowing down to become the four rivers that water all the corners of the earth so to speak. But then you get into situations and you have some choices to make. Something can be done about it. Jon: There just seems to be and this comes also from just how I grew up learning about the Bible, this was the fall. And we talked about that tree. The first tree looked over at the second tree. And now, he might stretch out his hand, and take also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever.”. “A Tale of Two Trees” (Genesis 2:8-9, 15-17; 3:1-24) This is “A Tale of Two Trees.” Oh, there were a whole bunch of other trees besides, lots of them, but this story will focus on just two. Jon: It is, yeah. Tim: To experience and eat from the tree of life, you have to walk by the tree of knowing good and bad and not take from it. That's the whole point of being wise. We're going to talk about a couple of the main characters in the Old Testament narrative and their relationship with trees, Noah, and Abraham. That helps me understand how I keep failing my test. I'm going to know what is good and what is bad, what kind of things will build up and what kind of things will destroy. Good and bad representing not just good and evil as philosophical moral categories, but good and bad in terms of... Jon: Things that create life and things that break things down. Romans 6:23 (NLT) 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of … She took from the tree, and she ate. So that's why I'm kicking you out of Eden.". We want life to make sense. Tim: The Bible came into existence within a culture that existed and lived and traveled between the Mediterranean Sea on the eastern end and the Persian Gulf across the desert. Like we take that just naturally. “What a juicy apple! And for some reason in English, and it might be just from like grade school, we often experience tests as prove your worth. Tim: And this is where I might be pondering the story for the rest of my life. We both had seasons in our lives where we made significant decisions, which at the moment seemed neutral. You're meditating. I desire that, and that will give it to me. Jon: So today on the show, we'll dive into the meaning of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. When it comes right down to it, this is a tale of two trees. Next week, we're going to continue to talk about trees. I don't have to earn eternal life, it's already a gift to me, but I can forfeit my chance and access to it by choosing my own knowing of good and bad. Which starts makes you think, "This is more than just your average snake." It's a gift. Jon: If you've been to Sunday school, you know how this ends. It is a famous children’s book that can be read as a basic primer about human beings in relationship to nature. Tim: I see. But he's just living out of impulses. Tim: Yeah. So that's a way they're different from the other human in history and in the story. Tim: Except God made a promise that a seed, back to tree and plant imagery, a seed would come from the woman who would undo all that has just been done in the garden. Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil. And it's the taking that leads them to start killing each other in the next chapter. As she reached the top of the hillside, she smiled at the two apple trees. And so what is moral maturity? The tree of knowing good bad represents a choice. Jon: It's interesting you have humans who are kind of in their infancy and then you have the serpent who is arum. The command is eat from all the trees which includes that one in the middle - the tree of life. “I’m sure glad my apples are enjoyed by everyone,” he said to himself. ” something” told me to Google the story of the Two Trees…strange because I have never herd of this before…I really enjoyed the story and will pass it along to the person who purchases website is Praise often misleads children into thinking they must perform for acceptance. Tim: Well, what he says is "Your eyes will be opened," meaning you'll be like Elohim knowing good and bad. He's sharp. One summer night, a fierce storm raged through the sleeping valley. Strategic. Yeah, brightening of eyes. The first movement of Genesis 3 introduces a snake in a positive way. But that's not. That's where we're at. But I trust that there is a seed coming who will undo what has been done. This guy's constantly having significant moments of his life in front of trees on top of really tall hills. Jon: I mean, kind of you're going back and forth between referring to it as a test and referring to it as just kind of the human condition. God also plants many trees there. That is true. Sometimes it doesn’t. The Garden of delights or what we call the Garden of Eden. It can make me feel like, "Oh, I could pass the test too.". Sign in to add your private notes…. The Gardner tells the first tree she will be proud of his apples. It looks good, it meets a need, and I want it. That's why it's right next to the tree of life. It's such a rich, multi-layered, little poetic line. First and foremost, wisdom and life are about listening to God’s voice. They were excited! I want to be wise. The tale of two trees tells us something profound about the human condition and the choice we all face. Tim: Yeah. Israel’s obedience to the covenant with God is compared to life and death: “So choose life” (Deuteronomy 30:19). Despite being nearly identical, their paths follow different paths. It has a calm sense of self that is evident with true self-esteem. Tim: Yeah. Tim: We shoot in the dark a lot of times. Jon: I think shrewd is neutral. The Tale of Two Trees. Well, it's all of the accumulation of life experiences and now the ability to understand how the world works more. Fear is on the Mic. Like you're just saying, like, you beat the game, you get the prize. YES! Sermon Description In this message, Pastor Louie Giglio from Passion City Church in Atlanta, GA shares a powerful sermon titled, "The Tale of Two Trees." He's shrewd. But it's like you're making the best decision with the least amount of unnecessary stuff leftover. Well, in a way they do become like Elohim knowing good and evil. “Someday, I will return to visit.” She turned and walked down the hillside. He was afraid he would not have apples on his branches. Tim: ...and he's going to receive the commands of the Torah - the covenant terms of the Torah. God plants a bunch of trees. Because good and bad doesn't just mean philosophical morality. The 1st tree in The Tale of Two Trees is the: Tree of Knowledge of good and evil. It's also about me and my failures and how my failures participate in the whole human species failure as far back as we can tell. And they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loin coverings. This is about two tall, dead trees. Tim: That's right. And those tangled roots actually made both of them stronger. God’s first command to humans is to enjoy the gift of life he wants to give them. Jon: God wants to rule with us, we're incapable of doing it, we've failed the test. 1hr 20m, –  The way trees exist in the world and the way that trees exist in this narrative is very similar. I think that's how many people read it. I think that's an important difference. He says it will kill you. The tree of good and bad is a warning about forfeiting what God has already given. This is back to that mercy. A Tale of Two Trees - Serpents of Desire, Part 2 by Rabbi David Fohrman Mankind's undetermined nature, perched precariously between mortality and immortality. Trees don't even need to be watered! The villagers are sure lucky to enjoy your wonderful gifts.”. Tim: No, no. When I was a new convert--having been brought from spiritual death to spiritual life--one of the things that I distinctly remember seeing with new eyes were trees. When the wind blows, the first tree is still concerned with his primary objectives in life of producing fruit. The question becomes whether they will receive it from God or choose to take it on their own terms. Jon: I can see, "Oh, that's life. The first command it doesn't place the tree of life off- limits, and then if you obey the command, then you get to the tree of life. So these two trees are intertwined. Tim: "It was the serpent. Respond to the test. Tim: Game over. Tim: That's not the storyline. That was His command was, "Enjoy it all. The Gardner searched the hillside and found a safe place for two little trees. Tim: Yeah. “It’s good that at least I have apples,” declared the first tree, “or else they would not want to visit us.”. And those choices could affect your friend - maybe what you do with the money may split up resources or how you apportion vacation time off. Tim: Strategic. Once again, the garden narrative in Genesis 3:22, God says. In part two (14:00-23:00), Tim and Jon talk about the intertwined relationship of the two trees in the garden. So in Psalm 1, you can be a tree planted by streams of water. In addition, we see how common parenting techniques affect the self-esteem of our children. Just as it sinks in over time, the command is to enjoy the good thing I want to give you. Seven Last Words Passion 2021 Series. Jon: Keeping up the tree of life while living in a state of death means that they don't have to live forever in death. And then to C. S. Lewis' thing of eating mud pies while you sit at the foot of a table full of cherry pies and apple pies and you think it's good, and you love it. Across the patchwork landscape, a snow-capped mountain loomed. It means responsibly making moral decisions and being responsible for them, which is a good thing. You're helping me be consistent. They longed for the rain to come. Jon: A test is like, I need you to prove your character. They have the next generation within them. –  So we're going to talk about a second tree and then what happens as a result of that second tree - the tree of knowing good and bad. That includes the tree of life. Jon Collins The second tree had no apples or leaves, but the children were still his friends. 58m, –  The trees are an image of the human condition; eternal life is a gift available to us, but in order to receive it, we have to refuse to live by our own wisdom. From the very beginning, the Tale of the Two Trees symbolized the Word of God: his blessing and his curse. The test before the tree of good and bad becomes a template for later tests that key characters will face in the biblical story. “I will be the best tree ever and make the Gardner proud,” he told himself. The Tale of Two Trees On Friday 8 th November an unexpected little smoke appeared in the bottom of Terania Creek Basin, somewhere near the Circle Pool. That's what he says in Psalm 51. Tim: The woman's quick on that. That's a thing that will kill me and hurt myself and others. It is yours. “It’s like a lullaby,” he thought. And that's what's going to happen in the narrative. It looks awesome, but I'm going to avoid it so that I can keep enjoying access to life. Instead of asking for forgiveness, Adam and Eve avoid God and shift blame. He played with the kids all afternoon. "The humans become like one of us knowing good and bad because they took from that tree. Tim: Does shrewd have a negative connotation? The tree in the centre forecourt was planted using the Stratacell™ suspended pavement system while the two trees near the sidewalk were planted in … Say the serpent has the capabilities you a Tale of two trees: Writes! Bring about the tree of life was in the garden of Eden. `` Hebrew idea of need. Humanity fails the test scolded the first thing they do is mistrust each other in garden! 'Ve been to Sunday school, you can find out all that we can good. 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